Over the last couple of years I’ve chatted to a number of people about wellbeing in the classroom but usually from a child’s point of view. And I’ve talked about resilience, growth mindset, all that kind of stuff. But one thing I’m always interested in is about a teacher’s own wellbeing. I was really happy to be joined by Paudie Moore, aka The Teacher’s Coach. And that’s exactly what he specialises in.
Transcript
Hello, hello, you're very welcome to If I Were the Minister for Education from Anshawe. net, a regular podcast where I look into the world of primary education and let you know what I would do if I were the Minister for Education. This is Simon Lewis. On this week's special, I have an interview with someone who you might be very interested in. If you're feeling a little bit down, a little lack of energy, and you're looking for someone or to help you out of that rush. Before we do, if you're interested in this podcast or any of my other episodes, you can go along to OnShot. net or subscribe on any of your favourite podcasting platforms to get a regular reminder of the podcast. If you also want to, you can subscribe to my newsletter, which not only reminds you of the podcast, but also provides you with some extra features, including extra news stories that have interested me, as well as some technology advice, which I produce on YouTube every couple of weeks. Okay, that's enough of a pitch from me. I hope you enjoyed the interview and I'll chat to you again. Hello, hello everybody. I am joined today by a very exciting guest because over the last couple of years I've chatted to a number of people about well being in the classroom but usually from a children's point of view. And so we've talked about resilience, growth mindset, all that kind of stuff. But I, one thing I'm always, I'm always interested in is about teachers own well being. We're big into helping children with their own well being. What about ourselves as teachers? And I'm really happy to be joined by Paddy Moore, who is from The Teacher's Coach. And that's exactly what he specializes in. Paddy's here is here with me from Limerick and I'm really, really eager to find out how I'm going to increase my own well being as well as I hope it'll help your own well being. Because every time I hear that word, I tend to shudder. After this interview, I'm sure I'll be seeing the word in a totally different light. Foddy, you're so welcome to If I Were the Minister for Education.
Speaker 2:Simon, thanks so much for having me here. It's fantastic to get the opportunity to have this chat with you today.
Speaker:No problem at all. Without sounding like the, the first question in a job interview tell us about yourself, Foddy.
Speaker 2:I'm a former woodworking Tektron teacher, and I would have grown up really sporty, I would have grown up on a farm, and so I would have always been really active. However, when I went to college priorities shifted a little bit, as you do, you go out that little bit more in college, etc. Sports took a back seat, wasn't really as active, so when I came to a point where I was ready to start teaching, I had found myself in the worst shape of my life. I had started to pick up every bad habit under the sun. And when I started teaching, things went downhill for me very, very quickly. So that thing prompted me to be in a situation where I needed to To find a way out. And that's something that I really struggled with. I feel that at the time I was looking around for something to suit me, but I couldn't find anything specifically for teachers. Everything that was out there at the time was very much centered around restriction and these six and eight week plans. That wasn't something that I really had much of an interest in. I wanted to be able to still live my life, but live a little bit healthier. I was at a loss, and it very much felt like there was no way out for me. I had been trying for quite a while to get myself back on track, but it was just failed attempt after failed attempt after failed attempt. And it wasn't until after two years as a teacher, I decided that I wanted to, to, to move from teaching in the UK to teaching in the UAE. That's Spurred me to, to get myself back on track because I figured that going over to a sunny climate, going over to the, to there, I couldn't be hiding away under a nice blazer, a nice woolly jumper anymore. So it was then that I started to, to get myself back into a good routine with, with my health and fitness from there.
Speaker:Brilliant, brilliant. And, so you, you went over to the UAE and you taught over there for a little bit of time, was it? Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I spent two years teaching in the UK, first of all, then I spent two years teaching in the UAE and it was coming towards the end of the second year, I found myself spending more time doing workout plans, doing diet plans than I was doing lesson plans. It was becoming clear at that point that there was a need for a change. Like I said, I got myself back into a routine because of the move to the UEE. But I had really found a passion for health and fitness at that point. And so I then decided that the teaching I'd given it a fair go after four years, it hadn't really taken for me. So I decided to, to, to go ahead first with the health and fitness side of things. So at that point, after two years of teaching the UE I left the teaching completely and I went working as a personal trainer and it was from there I had gone from almost earning. So what I've been earning as a week as a teacher, I was earning less per month as a PT, but I've never been happier. So it was clear to me at that point that I had really found something that I, that I was really passionate about.
Speaker:That's it. That's brilliant. It's so important to do the things you love. And to even, even if we are interviewed ended as quickly as this, I think one message, if you're not happy in a job, like there is it, there is life after, after I think particularly in teaching. Cause I think one of the things I found about teaching is that most people, and I know it's different now because of different routes into teaching. But a lot of people never leave school. They go to school in junior infants and come out of it retired as a teacher. They've never actually left a school building. And that can be, that's quite daunting in some ways. It's great. Congratulations for actually making the step. It's not an easy thing to do. So how did you get from being, a teacher to being a teaching coach? So that's
Speaker 2:So it actually, it turned out to be quite a natural progression for me. Like I say, I started off working on the gym floor because everybody who I looked up to in the industry at the time had all started in that way. It was always my goal that I wanted to become an online coach, but I knew that to become a good online coach, I first of all, needed to hone my craft on the, on the gym floor. So while I was working on the gym floor, I was also starting to try to build my online presence, but because. I was just after moving away from, from teaching most of the people who are following me online were all teachers.
Speaker:And
Speaker 2:very quickly what I started to realize was that even though my face to face clients I was seeing them maybe two or three times a week. It was my online clients who were getting far better results. And from, from what I saw from that was even from my own transformation, I knew that the training element was only a small part of the transformation puzzle. So in the online capacity, we were able to dig a lot deeper and be able to serve our clients in a much better capacity. But also because it came from the teaching background, I knew exactly the types of problems that the teaching clients would have been facing. So after spending two years on the gym floor, I I decided then to double down on what was really working and that was serving teachers. And that's when I went fully online. That was just over three years ago. And that's what we've been doing since.
Speaker:Brilliant. So you basically, you specialize in teacher health and wellbeing. So tell me, I suppose it might be a silly question, but what does a healthy teacher look like? And what are the kinds of things that makes an otherwise healthy teacher, not be healthy? What affects their wellbeing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's a fantastic question. I think that for a well balanced teacher, I think that they, in my opinion, it's someone who works hard but also has strict boundaries in place at the same time. So they're able to leave work and work and then have their own personal life. I think a healthy teacher is someone who feels energetic, who feels driven, who feels excited by what they do. And I think that what kind of gets in the way of that sometimes is that because just, just like me as a coach, teachers get into the role because they're passionate about helping other people. And I think that's absolutely fantastic. However, that can sometimes skew the work life balance. And it can sometimes mean that we're, we're, we're putting too much into our job and then there's not enough left to look after ourselves. Another thing that I find affecting teachers when it comes to prioritizing their health and fitness is the academic calendar. In fact it's, it's obviously one of the perks of being a teacher is, is the, the, the, the regular breaks, but that seems to make it quite challenging for teachers to be able to find a consistent flow. with their health and fitness routines because they're going to need one kind of routine that's going to serve them in their term time, but they're going to need another type of routine, maybe 50 to 60 percent of full capacity that will be able to enable them to stay consistent when they're out of their normal school routine as well.
Speaker:Yes. Yeah. Yeah. No, that makes, that makes a lot of sense. And, and are you, are you saying that a teacher a teacher whose health and being is working out quite well is, they have that divide between being in work zone and not being in work zone kind of thing? Would that be, would that be fair?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I think there has to, like you say, I think there has to be a divide and I also think that there has to be something that, that teachers can be quite prone to is putting other people's needs ahead of their own. And again, I think that's a fantastic quality that they're willing to do that, but more often than not, that can, that will lead to their detriment as well, because we need to appreciate that. we can't pour from an empty cup. And if you're not doing things on a regular basis to fill your own cup up first, that's eventually going to end up wearing you down. So that's why I'm saying I feel it's really important that we have that divide between work life and personal life and make sure that we're doing enough to be able to, to, to fill our cup up in both regards.
Speaker:Yeah. And do you think it's a kind of a, I'm not saying completely unique about teachers, but Do you feel teachers are re, somewhat unique in that thing that, that your, your day doesn't start and end when you're in the, in, in the work building? You're constantly thinking about your job. Is, is that, is that something unique to teachers or have you found that's, maybe, maybe it's, it's across the board these days?
Speaker 2:I think it's 100 percent unique to teachers. I think it's very hard for anybody outside of the teaching profession to understand just how draining the role can be. And I think we've all done the early role when someone makes a comment of, Oh, you're off half the year, or you're off at three o'clock in the day. I think it's very hard for, for someone outside of it to understand just how physically, mentally, emotionally draining it can be. And if you're not equipped with the tools, with the strategies to be able to, to reenergize yourself in all of those three areas, Again, it is going to have a negative impact and I think sometimes, because as teachers people look to us to have the answers, like students will look to us to have the answers for everything, I think even in social situations as a teacher people expect you to have the answers to a lot as well, and I think that we can sometimes unfairly do that. Thank you. Put that expectations on ourselves too, in that we expect to have, that we need to figure this out for ourselves when in fact you're an expert in your field, but you don't, you, and as a teacher, you have to wear so many hats. So at the end of the day, the last thing that you're going to want to do is, is to have to be your own health and fitness coach at the end of the day too.
Speaker:That's true enough. That's true enough. So I, I'm, I'm a, I'm a teacher. He, he, I've recognized, okay, I need to look after myself and I come along to you and I say, okay, I think I need to, need to do something for myself here. What, what kind of, what, what, what, what would be the first thing? You'd do with with a teacher who comes to you
Speaker 2:think that what's going to be most important is to first and foremost, realize that everybody's individual and even though we said that we had teachers specifically what a teacher who is a mom of three young kids is going to have a completely different lifestyle. So maybe. A guy who is in his fourth year single, so their lifestyles are going to look completely different. So the first stage of our, of our program for everybody that joins is we enter them into what we call a foundation phase. And that's basically us having a bit of a lifestyle audit for you. So we're going to see exactly what you're doing on a daily and a weekly basis, see what's serving you, see what's not. And then we're going to start to implement habits and routines from there that are going to start moving you in the direction towards the goals that you're looking to achieve.
Speaker:Okay. Okay. And, and in terms of the kind of goals that teachers might come to you with, what, what are the sort of, what, what sort of goals are, are, are, are they generally looking for? Is it, is it, is it, it's obviously fitness is part of it, but I presume there's other, other aspects. What kind of stuff do you come across?
Speaker 2:There's three main ones that we deal with on a most regular basis. One is going to be weight loss. People want to be able to come in, they want to be able to feel fantastic in their own skin. So weight loss confidence is going to come as a byproduct of that. And I think the confidence is going to come from you showing up and doing what you said you would do. So when you start setting and achieving goals for yourself, that's of course going to have a positive effect on your overall confidence. And what we found is that when you get somebody thriving in terms of their health and fitness, they're That confidence trickles into every other aspect of their life as well. Weight loss, confidence, and then energy, I think, is one of your most valuable currencies as a teacher. And I think if you don't have good energy on a daily basis, it's going to be very hard for you to be able to enjoy life. It's going to be very important for us to be able to equip our teachers with the strategies, with the tools, of how to be more efficient with their time, how to be able to create energy, how to be able to manage energy. How to manage the stress that goes hand in hand with the teaching. And those are three of the key areas that we primarily focus on with the teachers that we work with.
Speaker:Brilliant. And so tell me then so we've talked about the problems that, teachers might come to it. So what does a healthy teacher look like? Would you say, I know, I know that's a, a broad question, but
Speaker 2:I think a healthy teacher would be one who would have a good work life balance. Someone who can show up at their work, give their best to their, to their work. But when it comes to the end of the day, when it comes to maybe 4, 4 30, they can leave work and work. They can come home, they can compartmentalize, they can leave that there, and then they can be, they can be free to enjoy the rest of their evening. Whether that means that they're gonna go, go for a run, go to the gym, maybe go spend time with friends. they need to have more of a balanced lifestyle to be able to have that overall health focus.
Speaker:Yeah, no, that makes sense. I, I work with principals mainly. I'm a, I'm a principal myself. And there's all these reports out at the moment, there's a sustainability report being done by, by an organization, the IPPN. And the reports are saying the principles around the country are, have twice the amount of stresses as the national norm. They've, they're like, the, the figures just seem to be incredibly scary that we're pretty much killing ourselves from because of our job. And, and I, I, I, I then again wonder, I, I, there, with all the best rule in the world as a, as a principal versus a teacher. Is there something, can, I think, and I, I, I don't doubt that if a principal used the same concepts, they'll probably end up in the, in the, in a better place. Is there anything extra though, let's say, that a school leader might need to think about, because the job is, Just so crazy. Would you, would you have principal clients where you've had to do something a little bit different or is it just the same stuff that, that, that they need to do?
Speaker 2:I, I know exactly what you mean. My mother was actually a primary school principal herself, so I've witnessed firsthand the workload that comes with that. And we've actually got, we've actually got a handful of principals on the program at the moment. And I think that What we need to realise is that as a leader of the school, it's going to be important for you to lead from the front. So if it's the case that we're saying that it's going to be important to focus on well being in the school, it can't be a case where you as a principal are there till half eight, nine o'clock every night and burning the candle on both ends. I think that it's going to be important that, as I say, that you lead from the front and you make sure that if you're going to be preaching about the importance of well being, you need to be seen to be, to be prioritizing that in your own day to day life as well. I feel that in terms of the actual strategies to serve principals, there's not much of a difference that needs to be there. Of course, we need to be able to allow for the fact that a principal is going to have maybe more responsibility on their shoulders than a classroom teacher. However, that is going to work, that is going to depend very much on an individual basis as well.
Speaker:Hmm. Hmm. No, that, that, that makes that makes a lot of sense. I, I, I know it's probably the same, the same sort of thing, but I suppose in every job, there's, there's, it's, as you say, it's an individual thing. I, I, we talk, we've, we've skirted around the, the, this word well being a little bit, or I have anyway, at least. And, and, and I suppose I want to ask you about your opinion as someone who, who deals with teacher being. About the Department of Education's idea of well being. They have a well being framework. I'm not sure if you've ever had a look at it or seen it. And I wouldn't mind hearing your thoughts on that framework and whether you think it's any good or if it, if it's missing anything, what, what would it really be missing? And so a bit of a review of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So first of all, I think it's fantastic that it's something that the Department of Education are focusing in on. I think that's amazing.
Speaker:Okay.
Speaker 2:When I went through it, though, what I noticed was a gap in terms of teachers themselves. I think, again, it's, of course, it's going to be student focused, but I feel that there's a gap in terms of how teachers can look after themselves first and foremost, because I think it's going to be very hard for a teacher to be able to promote well being if they're burnt out. stressed out, maybe they haven't been prioritized, haven't been able to find the time to prioritize their health and fitness for the last number of years. I think it's going to be very hard for them to then be able to serve their students. So I think in terms of the policies that the Department of Education has set out, I think that there's a gap in terms of how do teachers look after themselves first and foremost, and be able to show up their very best. For their students then as well. I understand that there's there's a big focus being put in in terms of CPD and how to which is going to be teaching, which would be educating teachers on how to be able to serve their students better. But how do we, how do we look after ourselves better is something that I think there could be a bit more of a focus on.
Speaker:Yeah, I, I, I'd agree with you. It's, it's certainly something that I, I saw when I read the framework, I was thinking what about, what about us? And a question I asked a previous guest, because she was quite critical of the framework, was this idea that there's a lot of reliance and I think a lot of pressure on teachers because they have this idea that there's this one good adult in every school who looks after, the, the well being needs of, of, of children and that. Did you find the teachers? seem to take on that pressure a lot at their own expense.
Speaker 2:100%, 100%. And I've actually, I've actually dealt with a handful of teachers who were the well being coordinators for their schools. And these teachers themselves were struggling big time with prioritizing themselves. And I feel that again, that's where the gap is here is that if, if you. if you're struggling yourself, how are you going to be able to support other people? And I feel that there's, there's a lack of support for teachers in, in that area.
Speaker:Okay. And, and if we, if we had a magic wand and, and I know the name of this podcast is if I were the minister for education kind of thing. And if we, if you were the minister for education, but I want to ask you about that later, but if, but on this specific point, exactly about looking after teachers and we had our magic wand of being the minister, what would that kind of look like if for, for let, let's look at that because we are all going to have a well being coordinator in our schools. What do you, what kind of supports do you think they need in order to do their job?
Speaker 2:I think that they're going to need to know, number one, how to be able to put strong boundaries in place. How to be able to have a better work life balance so that they're not, like we said earlier, burning the candle on both ends, bringing work home with them, and then Shown up on maybe 30 to 40 percent battery at all times. They need to be, they need to be taught how to be able to create energy, how to be able to manage their energy so that they're going to be able to show up at their best as, as the leader for their class, for their students, even for their colleagues. I think that would be one one thing that where I would start with. Secondly, I think what teachers need is to be taught how to be able to have more helpful co op mechanisms in place. I think the job itself, as we said earlier, it's quite demanding both physically, mentally and emotionally. And I feel that if you're not, if you're not sure how to be able to re energize yourself physically, mentally and emotionally, it's going to be very hard for you to give back at your very best then as well. And I think that without us. knowledge. It's too easy to then turn to the unhelpful coping mechanisms. And that's why so many people that we deal with, they, they struggle a lot with snacking, with comfort eating. Some people might even turn to alcohol to help self suit because they don't know any better way of helping to deal with that stress. So I think that equipping Teachers with strategies, with skills of how to be able to overcome these would enable them to be able to show up in a much better, in a much better way.
Speaker:Yeah, I know that, that, that makes sense. And I suppose, we've talked about the fact that, this is a service you're providing to, can you tell us a little bit more about, the, the, the teacher coach, I'm calling it right, teacher's coach service. That if, if teachers were interested in, in, in maybe getting in touch to Maybe a bit of a blurb on what they should expect.
Speaker 2:Myself and my partner, who's also a former teacher we both work in the business together now, she heads up the nutrition side of things. We work with teachers who want to be able to take control of their health and fitness for good. We want to make sure that everyone that comes through our program, it's not just going to be another phase. We want to make sure that everything that we do, we're teaching our teachers how to be able to live with the results, live with their results for life. So we want to make sure that anyone that enters our program, it's going to be the last coaching program that they're ever going to need to sign up for. So we want to make sure that number one, they know exactly how to be able to stay consistent once they leave their time in the program. But number two, we want to make sure that everything that we do is adding to the quality of their life rather than making it are taken away from it. So we want to make sure that everything we do is complimenting our lifestyle rather than complicating it. So we want to make sure that if we're going to start prioritizing your health and fitness, we're going to make sure that we're showing up better energy. We're going to make sure that we're showing up and having a better relationship with food. We're going to make sure that we're going to learn how to be able to factor in what's important to us. If you'd like to go out for a meal or maybe a couple of drinks on the weekends. You're going to need to know how to be able to factor that in, rather than saying, I'm going to join this program, I'm going to hit it at 110 percent for the next eight weeks, and then I'm just going to go back to old habits and routines from there. Yeah. Yeah. We want to make sure that all of the changes that we do achieve, or all the results that we do achieve, you're equipped with the tools, with the knowledge, with the systems of how to be able to live with them for life.
Speaker:Brilliant. Brilliant. It sounds, it sounds great because I know there's a, a, a, Back when I was growing up, there was a lot of particularly weight loss programs that seemed to be one of those, it seemed to be unrealistic nearly to people's lifestyles, point counting and things like that, where, you were, you could eat whatever you wanted as long as you stayed under a certain amount of points, but it never really taught you, good habits. Is that, is that kind of what we're trying to, we're, we're moving to, moving from?
Speaker 2:100%, 100%. One thing that, that I think that, The switch that's needed there is that we need to stop looking at it as a phase and start looking at it as a lifestyle and you hit the nail on the head there by, by mentioning habits, like everything that we do, we need to be able to see ourselves being able to sustain for a long period of time. And I think that that's unfortunately where a lot of kind of, a lot of teachers will set themselves up for failure before they even begin. I think because as teachers. We're quite driven, quite ambitious. We can sometimes set that bar too high to begin with. So we might go from not, not working out at all to five days a week. And then we wonder why in four weeks time, we've completely fallen off track. We need to make sure that everything that we're doing at the, at the beginning. It feels realistic, it feels sustainable, and then you can build as you go from there, if necessary.
Speaker:Yeah, yeah, no, that, that, that makes that makes a lot of sense for, for sure. The last question I have to ask you is the one I ask every guest on the podcast, which is if you were the Minister for Education, you have your benign dictatorship for a day, and you can do whatever you wanted, and you can do more than one thing, and it doesn't have to be about health and fitness or well being at all. But it's to change the education system in any way you want it. Preferably a primary level, cause that's where I'm at. What would you, what is the one thing you would do if you were the minister for education?
Speaker 2:I might be, I might be looking to earn a couple of brownie points by saying this one, but I think the one thing that I would be, be focusing on is making sure the teachers are paid fairly. I think one thing that we I'm going to say I have been, maybe some of your listeners have also been, is been related to a childminder. And I feel like I, I know people who send their kids to childminders and they pay in rural Ireland, they pay 30, 30 euros a day. So if you were to say 30 euros a day per student and you had a regular class of 20 students, if you said 600 euros a day, five days a week, 3, 000 a week, Yeah, 3, 000 euros a week. That would be 12 grand a month. I think that that would be fair pay for if we're going to be compared to ChildMinder. I think that if you were to improve teachers pay, improve teachers well being, improve teachers work life balance. I think that we wouldn't be having the issues that we're having now with teacher shortages. I don't think that we'd have the issues now with so many teachers feeling the need to go further afield for employment. A lot of our younger teachers are immigrating to different parts of the world for better work, for better work life balance, really. And I think that that would be one of the first things that I would be looking to tackle if I was in that position.
Speaker:Yeah, I think, I think one of the things, and I think we've been like almost complacent around teaching that was, because it was always considered this cushy number third. great holidays, half day, blah, blah, blah, blah, that people sometimes would, would accuse us of. But the, the actual private sector, I feel, has caught up in terms of looking after employees being, and their, and their rights. Like perks, we, we just don't, that we now, in some ways, we have to compete with, that teaching isn't this kind of cushy job that it used to be. It's, it's definitely more complex than we know, we know all that. And I but but I think the, the other side of it is that, that the private sectors. Caught up like there are, imagine, I, I, I think the thought of actually working from home is so appealing. I know that will never happen for me because I've chosen to be a teacher, but, but it didn't exist when I started teaching. So would I have gone into teaching if I knew I had, there was another job where I I might be able to work from home or I might have a flexible work work time. I might be able to take, certain types of leave. I could do this 80 20 kind of style where 20 percent of my day is spent on things I actually like, enjoy doing. All those sort of things, I think, feed into it. And then, of course, as you say, conditions in countries like in the Gulf States or even, other places. We do have to compete with it. So I don't think, I don't think you're wrong there. I think sometimes we're, we're so complacent. And I think the, I'm not so sure. Blaming the media because it's everybody whenever I say I'm a teacher, the first thing they ask me is about holidays you you at some point, you go actually do you know when it comes down to it? Yes, that is absolutely a wonderful kind of thing. To have If we're comparing, we're not comparing, like with like anymore, different jobs have different things to make and you, you, you, you found that teaching was something that, you found that you, wasn't something that you were going to be able to sustain, and this is a job now that you can sustain, and was good for your wellbeing, not, not because of hours or any of that, but, the day that you, you found that you were I think, I think we do have to make teaching attractive. Or more attractive. We can't just presume. It's, ah sure, aren't they grand, they're just minding, minding kids. And so on. Would that be fair? Am I being, am I being unfair there?
Speaker 2:I think we're both very much singing off the same hymn sheet. And I think that it, If there isn't something done about it, like it's a profession where people are leaving in their droves almost every year. So I think there is a need for change in some way. But I don't think I'll ever be in that position of power, so I don't think it'll be up to me to come up with the solution to it. Dreaming. Exactly.
Speaker:You never know, you never know. But listen, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you, Paddy, and thanks so much for for joining me on If I Were the Minister for Education. If people want to reach out and find you, what's the easiest way to get you?
Speaker 2:On Instagram, pottymoreteacherscoach will be the best way to contact me. Brilliant.
Speaker:Thanks so much, Potty. A pleasure talking to you.
Speaker 2:You too, Simon. Thanks so much for the opportunity.
Speaker:There you have it. I hope you enjoyed that interview, and if you have and you'd like to hear more interviews, please from me with some of the most interesting people in primary education. You can go to unshot. net for more of them. If you've enjoyed this podcast, you can subscribe to the podcast using your favorite platform, whether that is Google Podcasts or Apple Podcasts. Podcasts or Spotify or any of your other platforms. I'm also on YouTube as well if you want to tune in and watch along. You can also look at my techie tips every couple of weeks which are also on YouTube. And you can subscribe to my newsletter which has even more stuff. Which is which can be found on on shop. net slash subscribe. And that will give you an email every day. Two weeks and I promise no junk mail in there. So that's it for me for this week. We'll catch you again in a couple weeks time. All the very best. Bye bye.